U18's Whats going on?

[Dino]

After yet another dreadful game yesterday, I have to ask, what is going on with the U18's?

Last season they were a good team, played nice football and never looked out of their depth, ok we lost 3-4 players due to the age thing but we have some good youngsters coming up to fill those spots.

This season (and i've only seen the home games) Ive never seen the same 11 start, there are 3 - 5 changes each time they step out. The defense has been poor all season, making the same silly mistakes and giving easy goals away.
Last season Nathan Waterston was solid in defense, and Edmo made him his man of the match for the great job he did when AFC played Furness select at the start of the season, why isnt Nathan performing this season? Well apart from missing a few games due to injury he's been played up front!!!
Just think about that for a minute, best defender and you play him up front!
Mikey Thomson, great on the left running at people down the wing, scored and assisted most of the goals last season, seems to be playing in about 4 different positions depending where we are in the game, and yesterday was taken off 20mins into the 2nd half only to be brought back on 10mins later!!

While i'm talking about substitutions, it seems that much like the way school teams are run these days, everyone that turns up gets a run out, 5 substitutions per game is normal and they start 20mins into the match regardless of how the game is going.
I'm all for giving the younger ones a game or 2 but giving everyone 20mins does nothing, it upsets the flow there is no settled team its just been a joke this season, more so when we were so good last year.
What happens next season? Do the younger ones from this year get to start the matches only to be subbed after 20mins to make way for even younger ones, I thought the idea of this was to develop players to the point where they can start to challenge for a position in the 1st team squad, with the way its being run its not going to happen sadly.

Last year 120+ people watched each home game (200+ on 1 occasion) you paid a couple of quid to get in money obviously going towards running the performance centre) you could even get a drink and occasionaly something to eat.
This year, there was the odd person at the gate asking for you to make a donation, you got a program (but not had one in the last 2 games or even been asked to donate) no chance of a drink or anything to eat and at 1 match the home fans were outnumbered by the away fans, and even then there were less than 50 there, 30 -40 being average this year.


So having suffered the freezing cold, watched another defeat next time i'll be playing the U18 drinking game.
Every time a goal is scored you have a pint
Every time the U18's make a substitution you drink a shot/short.

By the time 90 mins is up you wont feel the cold or care what the score was.

If you had played the drinking game yesterday you would have had 6 pints (beat 4-2) and had 7 (yes 7) shots/shorts, not a bad afternoon!!!


I dont blame the kids, they are working their arses off, but it cant be easy when for the first 20 mins your nearest team mate is on your wavelength then you turn round and theres another kid there who isnt up to speed yet, by the time you get up to speed with him you find yourself sat on the bench!!!

If the 1st team was run like this the calls of 'Edmo out' would be very loud, but its only the kids no one seems to care, if anyone thinks the performance centre is going to be bringing kids into the 1st team then sorry i just dont see it happening unless the FA change the substitution rules and allow 15 subs per game.

In 14 games so far this season there isnt 1 single player that has played all 1260mins, there are at least 6 players who haven't played a full 45mins.
From the team sheets from the first 6 games there have been 29 different players, with at least 3 subs used each game (often more) is it any wonder why we dont have a settled team? Of those 29 at least 25 got on for 20+mins or so. To my knowledge and i may be wrong but i only know of 1 player that has started every game this season, thats in the league, one of the cup games he started from the bench then came on after the standard 20 mins!!!!
I will point out that in 1 away game no subs were used, this is because they only managed to get 11 players to turn up and one was sent off near the start of the game, 29 players and cant get 13-14 to turn up for a game!!!!

So far this season, out of 2 cups at the first attempt, in the league P14 W1 D2 L11 GD -36


So what's going on???

[barrowfan_chris]

Doesnt sound good does it.

What coaching qualifications do our youth coaches have?

[Ziggerzagger]

It's the same policy with all the youth age groups.the under 11s played 9 a side game yesterday and took 5 subs to an away game at Curzon.nepotism rules the youth teams and once selected your in for good unless you leave yourself.lots of more talented kids playing in the junior league that don't and won't get a look in.its not an academy more like a closed shop for the blue eyed boys and friends of friends.

[mickmike wilson]

It's the same policy with all the youth age groups,

Nepotism rules the youth teams and once selected your in for good unless you leave yourself.lots of more talented kids playing in the junior league that don't and won't get a look in.its not an academy more like a closed shop for the blue eyed boys and friends of friends.

Wrong, wrong, wrong if this is correct.

[Big E]

That certainly wasn't the case last year, and knowing the lads who run it, I'd be surprised if that was happening this year.

They knew this year would be tough - lost some good players and moved into a higher level of football. perhaps they've realised that and intend to rotate things around to find out who is good enough and who isn't.

It's a steep learning curve for all involved, to call them out after one season is a bit off in my opinion. Meeks has a massive say in the set up now, so perhaps they are working out a cunning plan and don't feel the need to publish it to the world just yet...

Plus the 1st XI was so dross folk drifted into see how they were doing last year - perhaps the sudden interest in the current activities have had a negative effect on the U18's.

[The Real Slim Azza]

Who watches 16/17/18 year olds play football and plays drinking games with themselves!?

[snortypig]

It's the same policy with all the youth age groups,

Nepotism rules the youth teams and once selected your in for good unless you leave yourself.lots of more talented kids playing in the junior league that don't and won't get a look in.its not an academy more like a closed shop for the blue eyed boys and friends of friends.

Wrong, wrong, wrong if this is correct.

Ziggerzagger is spot on with his comments - ask any JFC coach in the area, they'll confirm it.

This topic was discussed on here a few seasons back and nothing noticeable has changed, yes (at one age group AFAIA) there's there's been a one-off move by one of the lads to Carlisle Utd and another left as his parents moved south but apart from that it's the same lads as were chosen years back on a cold and windy Sunday morning at St Bernards school fields..................

Ziggerzagger - yep, there's a lot of talent that's been overlooked, it's a shame. A real shame.

[barrowfan_chris]

Thats just wrong we should be picking the best local youngsters how do we expect to get the best local talent playing for us in the future?

Now its under the clubs control surely we can change the way its run?

[barrowboy1991]

:flag:

[barrowaberdeen]

I don't know too much about this but I do care about it so I wonder if anyone could answer these questions

Questions for the club:

What have you done to move what was 'a performance centre' laudably but privately funded closer towards an academy structure? What is the long term aim? Are we valuing the process enough?

Questions for those who are unhappy in JFL circles

Are you replacing the perennial complaints locally about the club taking no notice of good young players with complaining that the wrong ones are picked and it's a closed shop?

How would you move it forward? I would suspect nobody in the JFL in Barrow wants a full academy..

For me, it's a lot better than what we had before but any football team at a new level will struggle at first. Neil Doc always used to make the point that the best younger local players wouldn't come up against a high enough standard regularly enough. I am alarmed if it really is the case that the wrong players are being picked or it is a 'closed shop'.

[OfficialYouth]

Firstly thank you for taking the time to write about your opinions on the Centre and how you think it is currently operating. I feel that following your interest and lengthy piece the best I can do is inform everyone of where we are at this moment, and reiterate what has been mentioned previously by Neil Doherty.

The Centre is currently being overseen by our new Head of Youth Alex Meechan. Since his appointment in August, we have been looking at ways to take the Centre to the next level and have a plan of how we want things to operate. Changes have been minimal recently as we take a season of change. New methods have been added to our training regime, more contacts with clubs and an overhaul of our player assessment. We have our match analysis team in full swing, have had rave reviews about our new Physiotherapist and are working closely with Paddy Maher who is the Strength and Conditioning coach for the 1st Team. Furthermore our GK coach Ross Liddicott and U14 coach Marc McAloone have been involved in the 1st team operations this season.

Contact time that players receive at the Centre is considerably lower than at any other Academy as all players still play and train with their local clubs. Most clubs and academies in the North West play fixtures on a Sunday, where the B&DJFL play on a Saturday, meaning it is tough for us to get games against clubs. However we have played Blackburn Rovers, Morecambe and Airbus UK to name a few so far. Our juniors face Carlisle Utd on Sunday and Crewe Alexandra in 2 weeks time, an U18 side will face Bradford City in February and we are scheduling fixtures with Blackpool and Preston NE to name a few. Members of the U18 sides are contracted to their clubs (like the juniors) and therefore players are not always fully-fit for the next game, which has sometimes led to a smaller pool of players to select from for Sunday fixtures. Combine this with a much tougher league and increased standard of competition and this will suggest the difference between this season and last season. Our U18 LFA team have started well in the midweek Floodlit League that we entered last season. Our coaches do a fantastic job and I invite the people of this post to come down to a training session to watch what we do. If this is something of interest then please do get in touch and I can arrange this for you.

Closed Shop

Ziggerzagger has mentioned this on numerous occasions, yet this is hardly the case and this has been repeated on numerous occasions:

- Players are given reports twice per season (some have gone as far as mentioning that the detail and effort we put into reports mimics or exceeds that of professional academies).
-If we feel that a player has not progressed in their position after 6 months of any weaknesses highlighted then we turn to our release policy and procedure.
- If we feel that there are players out there who are stronger than current Centre players in the same position then we will turn to our Player Induction Policy.

Again, we are more than happy to discuss this further in person.

At this present moment we have a number of players who were invited on trial with squads this season, some of which have been inducted and some who have returned to their clubs. It is really pleasing that we have also had players from other Academies and Centres contact us about trialling with us.

In response to SnortyPig and his take on the current U15 squad, he is correct that one player left to relocate with his family and one midfielder was signed by Carlisle United; signed from the club that I believe he manages at Holker Old Boys? Two players have also left the Centre through our release procedure and three had been brought in from various clubs in the B&DJFL. One U14 player has also been moved up to the U15 squad as we feel he is good enough and one U15 player has moved to the U16s. Therefore a total of 9 changes to the squad last season alone.

Mimicking the post made by Neil Doherty on 27th June 2014, please find that the facts prove we are not a closed shop:

U18- 12 new players & 1 invited on trial
U17- 7 new players & 3 invited on trial.
U16- 7 new players & 4 invited on trial.
U15- 6 new players & 3 invited on trial
U14- 3 new players
U13- 3 new players
U12- 3 new players & 3 invited on trial
U11- 12 players initially selected with 7 on trial for a further 6 weeks, playing 3 trial games against local clubs. Of that 4 players were selected to join the Centre.

Considering the geographical location of our town and the number of players that play football in each age group, the catchment area for players is small compared to clubs in larger towns and cities. However, discussions have taken place to extend our catchment area very soon, and new policies have been put in place. We are now attending more matches than ever before and our volunteering staff recorded attendance at 70+ local junior games last season, as well as attending the Furness Futsal tournament and Holker Street tournament. We would of course like to do more but it is not always possible with work and family commitments, as anyone who has a young family will understand.

I recognise that people will be disappointed when their son, nephew or friends son doesn’t get a place in the Performance Centre and I would love to have shadow squads in place to increase competition. At this present time this is not possible but discussions have taken place, and with the addition of the new 3G facility to be built on the training pitch in the near future, we are closer to running shadow squads than before.

Finally I must say that we are always willing to take the time to listen to constructive criticism, and always have time to discuss the Centre with anyone in passing. However, despite the building of this project from 16 players and 1 member of staff 6 years ago, to 8 squads containing roughly 135 players, 12 members of our coaching team, a match analysis team, physiotherapist and strength and conditioning coach, I find it disappointing and unhelpful when incorrect statements are posted publically with very little knowledge of the logistics and operations of the Centre. What makes this both frustrating and upsetting for our staff is that we have never been fully approached about the issues raised? I know from the feedback we receive not just from locals but others at other professional academies we have come across are pleased and positive in their opinions. We do understand that the means of selection can be frustrating for people who unfortunately are not selected and this means there will always be unhappy people.

On behalf of Alex and the staff, I ask that any questions are mentioned directly to us. I would like to believe, and hopefully all will agree, that we are very approachable and take time out to discuss the Centre when we can.

We all care very deeply and passionately for what has been carefully built over 6 years and are always looking to improve.

Thank you for taking the time to create the post and I hope I have answered any questions.

Yours in Sport,

Liam Reid
Assistant Head of Youth

[Andy]

Well said Liam.

[Big E]

Firstly thank you for taking the time to write about your opinions on the Centre and how you think it is currently operating. I feel that following your interest and lengthy piece the best I can do is inform everyone of where we are at this moment, and reiterate what has been mentioned previously by Neil Doherty.

The Centre is currently being overseen by our new Head of Youth Alex Meechan. Since his appointment in August, we have been looking at ways to take the Centre to the next level and have a plan of how we want things to operate. Changes have been minimal recently as we take a season of change. New methods have been added to our training regime, more contacts with clubs and an overhaul of our player assessment. We have our match analysis team in full swing, have had rave reviews about our new Physiotherapist and are working closely with Paddy Maher who is the Strength and Conditioning coach for the 1st Team. Furthermore our GK coach Ross Liddicott and U14 coach Marc McAloone have been involved in the 1st team operations this season.

Contact time that players receive at the Centre is considerably lower than at any other Academy as all players still play and train with their local clubs. Most clubs and academies in the North West play fixtures on a Sunday, where the B&DJFL play on a Saturday, meaning it is tough for us to get games against clubs. However we have played Blackburn Rovers, Morecambe and Airbus UK to name a few so far. Our juniors face Carlisle Utd on Sunday and Crewe Alexandra in 2 weeks time, an U18 side will face Bradford City in February and we are scheduling fixtures with Blackpool and Preston NE to name a few. Members of the U18 sides are contracted to their clubs (like the juniors) and therefore players are not always fully-fit for the next game, which has sometimes led to a smaller pool of players to select from for Sunday fixtures. Combine this with a much tougher league and increased standard of competition and this will suggest the difference between this season and last season. Our U18 LFA team have started well in the midweek Floodlit League that we entered last season. Our coaches do a fantastic job and I invite the people of this post to come down to a training session to watch what we do. If this is something of interest then please do get in touch and I can arrange this for you.

Closed Shop

Ziggerzagger has mentioned this on numerous occasions, yet this is hardly the case and this has been repeated on numerous occasions:

- Players are given reports twice per season (some have gone as far as mentioning that the detail and effort we put into reports mimics or exceeds that of professional academies).
-If we feel that a player has not progressed in their position after 6 months of any weaknesses highlighted then we turn to our release policy and procedure.
- If we feel that there are players out there who are stronger than current Centre players in the same position then we will turn to our Player Induction Policy.

Again, we are more than happy to discuss this further in person.

At this present moment we have a number of players who were invited on trial with squads this season, some of which have been inducted and some who have returned to their clubs. It is really pleasing that we have also had players from other Academies and Centres contact us about trialling with us.

In response to SnortyPig and his take on the current U15 squad, he is correct that one player left to relocate with his family and one midfielder was signed by Carlisle United; signed from the club that I believe he manages at Holker Old Boys? Two players have also left the Centre through our release procedure and three had been brought in from various clubs in the B&DJFL. One U14 player has also been moved up to the U15 squad as we feel he is good enough and one U15 player has moved to the U16s. Therefore a total of 9 changes to the squad last season alone.

Mimicking the post made by Neil Doherty on 27th June 2014, please find that the facts prove we are not a closed shop:

U18- 12 new players & 1 invited on trial
U17- 7 new players & 3 invited on trial.
U16- 7 new players & 4 invited on trial.
U15- 6 new players & 3 invited on trial
U14- 3 new players
U13- 3 new players
U12- 3 new players & 3 invited on trial
U11- 12 players initially selected with 7 on trial for a further 6 weeks, playing 3 trial games against local clubs. Of that 4 players were selected to join the Centre.

Considering the geographical location of our town and the number of players that play football in each age group, the catchment area for players is small compared to clubs in larger towns and cities. However, discussions have taken place to extend our catchment area very soon, and new policies have been put in place. We are now attending more matches than ever before and our volunteering staff recorded attendance at 70+ local junior games last season, as well as attending the Furness Futsal tournament and Holker Street tournament. We would of course like to do more but it is not always possible with work and family commitments, as anyone who has a young family will understand.

I recognise that people will be disappointed when their son, nephew or friends son doesn’t get a place in the Performance Centre and I would love to have shadow squads in place to increase competition. At this present time this is not possible but discussions have taken place, and with the addition of the new 3G facility to be built on the training pitch in the near future, we are closer to running shadow squads than before.

Finally I must say that we are always willing to take the time to listen to constructive criticism, and always have time to discuss the Centre with anyone in passing. However, despite the building of this project from 16 players and 1 member of staff 6 years ago, to 8 squads containing roughly 135 players, 12 members of our coaching team, a match analysis team, physiotherapist and strength and conditioning coach, I find it disappointing and unhelpful when incorrect statements are posted publically with very little knowledge of the logistics and operations of the Centre. What makes this both frustrating and upsetting for our staff is that we have never been fully approached about the issues raised? I know from the feedback we receive not just from locals but others at other professional academies we have come across are pleased and positive in their opinions. We do understand that the means of selection can be frustrating for people who unfortunately are not selected and this means there will always be unhappy people.

On behalf of Alex and the staff, I ask that any questions are mentioned directly to us. I would like to believe, and hopefully all will agree, that we are very approachable and take time out to discuss the Centre when we can.

We all care very deeply and passionately for what has been carefully built over 6 years and are always looking to improve.

Thank you for taking the time to create the post and I hope I have answered any questions.

Yours in Sport,

Liam Reid
Assistant Head of Youth

Thanks Liam, great to hear things are moving along well and progressing.

I witnessed 1st hand last year your management of the U18's and was very impressed with both yourself and Dan, if you continue to work this way it won't be long before we see a product of the system involved in the 1st team squads. Just need to get that reserve side up and running now

Ian

[K-Man]

A good response to unfair criticism.

[mickmike wilson]

Thanks for that Liam,

It all sounds good & very encouraging & I am sure 99% off people will be happy with this report & progression, but I feel that some of you have taken any criticism to heart when it really shouldn't be.

If we get a report every quarter or so im sure we'd all be up to speed or could post any questions at that time.

Thanks for everything you guys do & please carry on nurturing the future talent.